POKÉMANIAC SIPH wants to fight! @Siphonay

6 posts3 participants0 posts today

Diego Carrasco G.<a href="https://chaos.social/@delta" class="u-url mention" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">@delta</a> Thanks for the reply! I created a profile on android in the default <a href="https://mas.to/tags/chatmail" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#chatmail</a> and I used a new account in my email server (custom domain with infomaniak) for a second profile in mz Linux Desktop to check out how this works. I see <a href="https://mas.to/tags/deltachat" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#deltachat</a> created a new imap folder in my email server and started adding emails there (as expected).

Delta Chat<a href="https://mas.to/@daco" class="u-url mention" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">@daco</a> we always recommend dedicated accounts and not sharing an e-mail address with another e-mail client. For newcomers among your friends, they will then not have to care about an an e-mail address at all but can just use the default onboarding one or other <a href="https://chaos.social/tags/chatmail" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#chatmail</a> server servers. We strive for users not having to *think* about e-mail when onboarding the first time. But if you can create an e-mail address yourself somehwere, by all means, go for it ;)

Delta Chat<a href="https://aus.social/@mattcen" class="u-url mention" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">@mattcen</a> We beg to disagree a little :) The e-mail system is a very wondrous beast and we are untapping interesting new possibilities with our <a href="https://chaos.social/tags/chatmail" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#chatmail</a> efforts. As to sealed sender/receivers that's entirely possible. However, we prefer to make further arguments in released code when the time comes and stars align ;)

Delta Chat<a href="https://chaos.social/tags/Signal" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#Signal</a> took a huge bet that running on US big-tech toxic infrastructure is fine because its groundbreaking and industry-shaping cryptography is crafted to neutralize it and keep users safe. But is it really feasible to live on toxic infrastructure in the longer run? <a href="https://chaos.social/tags/deltachat" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#deltachat</a> rather takes a bet on the massive e-mail server network and interoperable protocols, and on <a href="https://chaos.social/tags/chatmail" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#chatmail</a> servers which enforce message encryption and metadata-minimization. Delta is for when centralization turns sour.

Delta ChatGreat stuff! A thorough step-by-step guide for setting up a <a href="https://chaos.social/tags/chatmail" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#chatmail</a> server from <a href="https://hachyderm.io/@nerdvm" class="u-url mention" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">@nerdvm</a> includes also considerations regarding firewall, setting up of ssh and some topics left out of the current main setup guide. Note that even on a very small server you can easily host 10Ks of active chatmail addresses so if you succeed setting up a server don't be shy letting others know the domain :)<a href="https://blog.lifeupgraded.me/setup-a-chatmail-server-for-delta-chat/" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" translate="no" target="_blank">https://blog.lifeupgraded.me/setup-a-chatmail-server-for-delta-chat/</a>

Delta Chat<a href="https://freiburg.social/@derenglischekoenig" class="u-url mention" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">@derenglischekoenig</a> Services that <a href="https://chaos.social/tags/chatmail" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#chatmail</a> adds like "filtermail" run as its own user or as "vmail" if they need to access mailboxes. "echobot" is sandboxed to some extent using systemd.

Delta ChatThere is no shortage of startups and enterprises animated by, or outright proclaiming, replacing e-mail as the de-facto open internet messaging standard. VC Investors are forever fascinated by funding such endeavours. <a href="https://chaos.social/tags/matrix" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#matrix</a> <a href="https://chaos.social/tags/simplex" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#simplex</a> <a href="https://chaos.social/tags/slack" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#slack</a> etc are examples.<a href="https://chaos.social/tags/deltachat" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#deltachat</a> endorses e-mail but reconfigures and repurposes it to serve for interoperable instant messaging. The <a href="https://chaos.social/tags/chatmail" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#chatmail</a> server network relays end to end encrypted e-mail only, and servers are reduced to dumb store-and-forward relays.

Delta Chat<a href="https://akk.fedcast.ch/users/hiker" class="u-url mention" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">@hiker</a> every App allows to create anonymous chat profiles on <a href="https://chaos.social/tags/chatmail" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#chatmail</a> servers. Just hit "create profile"

Delta Chat<a href="https://freiburg.social/@derenglischekoenig" class="u-url mention" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">@derenglischekoenig</a> <a href="https://gts.lylapol.com/@jpdvm2014" class="u-url mention" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">@jpdvm2014</a> <a href="https://chaos.social/tags/chatmail" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#chatmail</a> setup docs are here <a href="https://github.com/chatmail/server/" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" translate="no" target="_blank">https://github.com/chatmail/server/</a> if you hit any problem feel free to open an issue in the same repo. Popular problems: - DNS settings (a zone file is provided but most providers don't allown importing) - getting your hosting provider to allow sending and receiving to/at port 25

JonI held off for a week, but now I'm officially <a href="https://gts.lylapol.com/tags/selfhosting" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#selfhosting</a> a <a href="https://gts.lylapol.com/tags/deltachat" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#deltachat</a> <a href="https://gts.lylapol.com/tags/chatmail" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#chatmail</a> server! Took some troubleshooting to get it up, but nothing too difficult. <a href="https://chaos.social/@delta" class="u-url mention" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">@delta</a>

iroh<a href="https://chaos.social/@Junicast" class="u-url mention" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">@Junicast</a> <a href="https://chaos.social/@kubikpixel" class="u-url mention" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">@kubikpixel</a> Yes, building magic wormhole with iroh direct connections would be cool! Currently magic wormhole traffic is all relayed via a server AFAIK. Iroh is open source, and you can self-host a relay. And iroh runs on mobiles. E.g. <a href="https://chaos.social/@delta" class="u-url mention" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">@delta</a> does all of those things and integrates an <a href="https://mastodon.social/tags/iroh" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#iroh</a> relay in their <a href="https://mastodon.social/tags/ChatMail" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#ChatMail</a> server. And <a href="https://mastodon.social/tags/DeltaChat" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#DeltaChat</a> runs on mobiles.

Delta Chat<a href="https://friends.chasmcity.net/profile/gmc" class="u-url mention" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">@gmc</a> You don't have to install the server, you can use a public <a href="https://chaos.social/tags/chatmail" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#chatmail</a> server or setup a normal email server with e.g. <a href="https://mailcow.social/@doncow" class="u-url mention" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">@doncow</a> if you want to self-host your email. You can also setup a <a href="https://chaos.social/tags/chatmail" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#chatmail</a> server just for yourself and then close new account registration if you don't want to offer it as a service for others but want to have push notifications working.

xeniax ⏚Everything you knew about Delta Chat is wrong 😎 <a href="https://chaos.social/@delta" class="u-url mention" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">@delta</a> Thanks feld@friedcheese.us for this amazing blogpost that busts myths and stereotypes about Delta Chat:<a href="https://blog.feld.me/posts/2025/03/deltachat-is-actually-good-though/" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" translate="no" target="_blank">https://blog.feld.me/posts/2025/03/deltachat-is-actually-good-though/</a><a href="https://mastodon.ml/tags/deltachat" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#deltachat</a> <a href="https://mastodon.ml/tags/chatmail" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#chatmail</a> <a href="https://mastodon.ml/tags/pgp" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#pgp</a> <a href="https://mastodon.ml/tags/messaging" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#messaging</a> <a href="https://mastodon.ml/tags/e2ee" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#e2ee</a> <a href="https://mastodon.ml/tags/messengers" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#messengers</a>

Delta Chat<a href="https://mastodon.social/@mavu" class="u-url mention" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">@mavu</a> We use <a href="https://chaos.social/tags/postfix" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#postfix</a> in <a href="https://chaos.social/tags/chatmail" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#chatmail</a> setup, and so does <a href="https://mailcow.social/@doncow" class="u-url mention" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">@doncow</a> It is well-documented and in our setup at <a href="https://github.com/chatmail/server" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" translate="no" target="_blank">https://github.com/chatmail/server</a> there are only two small postfix configs.

Delta Chat<a href="https://jura.social/@mathilde" class="u-url mention" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">@mathilde</a> <a href="https://chaos.social/tags/chatmail" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#chatmail</a> server users don't have these problems because they don't even need to know their password or email address. Messages in delta chat are stored locally and the server only stores them for a limited time, up to 20 days by default, so all devices have a chance to download the message. Blocklists are also not used, the only requirements are <a href="https://chaos.social/tags/DKIM" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#DKIM</a> signature and <a href="https://chaos.social/tags/OpenPGP" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#OpenPGP</a> encryption.

rohden<a class="u-url mention" href="https://chaos.social/@delta" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">@delta</a> <a class="u-url mention" href="https://fosstodon.org/@fabrice" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">@fabrice</a> <a class="u-url mention" href="https://friedcheese.us/users/feld" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">@feld</a> <a class="hashtag" href="https://fe.disroot.org/tag/chatmail" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#chatmail</a> if a single device setup is used end-to-end encrypted message get removed after the app downloaded it. The situation is different for multi device setups, right?

Delta Chat<a href="https://fosstodon.org/@fabrice" class="u-url mention" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">@fabrice</a> <a href="https://friedcheese.us/users/feld" class="u-url mention" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">@feld</a> <a href="https://chaos.social/tags/chatmail" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#chatmail</a> servers do not keep persistent logs, and only the end-devices have the readable messages of a conversation. Servers briefly see an end-to-end encrypted message but it gets removed after the app downloaded it.

Delta Chat<a href="https://privacysafe.social/@mikalai" class="u-url mention" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">@mikalai</a> good point! The first years we had to make do with classic email servers. We barely expected anything else than "send message" and "receive message" to work. There was no way to get big email providers to change anything. When we then went for the <a href="https://chaos.social/tags/chatmail" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#chatmail</a> concept it meant the server doesn't need to do anything than to transport the message. No metadata, no rooms, no group state that most other messengers keep on their servers. Crossing out server state makes <a href="https://chaos.social/tags/deltachat" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#deltachat</a> p2p-ish

Delta ChatThe downside of our project approach was that we often got experts being very dismissive on re-using email and <a href="https://chaos.social/tags/OpenPGP" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#OpenPGP</a> ... and there still is some opposition which often subsides when actually trying <a href="https://chaos.social/tags/deltachat" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#deltachat</a> and <a href="https://chaos.social/tags/chatmail" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#chatmail</a>, looking at security audits and our strong usable security focus. There may also be surprising upsides. The UK "Online Safety Bill" which attacks end-to-end encryption integrity seems to not apply for ... e-mail. Because everyone knows, e-mail is unencrypted, right? :)

Delta Chat<a href="https://tech.lgbt/@risottobias" class="u-url mention" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">@risottobias</a> <a href="https://mastodon.online/@lvk" class="u-url mention" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">@lvk</a> we work with the assumptions stated here <a href="https://github.com/chatmail/models/tree/main/group-membership#assumptions" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" translate="no" target="_blank">https://github.com/chatmail/models/tree/main/group-membership#assumptions</a> and those include that the group-id is secret and only known to the members. <a href="https://chaos.social/tags/Chatmail" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">#Chatmail</a> servers never see the group id as it is transmitted in the end-to-end encrypted part of messages between peers.

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